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Discussions about specific materials / Fucked Up Logic
« on: February 03, 2010, 05:16:51 AM »
Your website brings up some interesting points, and while I understand it was written by a mind damaged by betrayal and disillusionment with the parent culture, It is a shame to say the problems are all just too hard so lets encourage someone to build a weapon to destroy all life because all life involves suffering... When you die it makes no difference whether you suffered or not in life and so an equally extremist point of view could be that nothing means anything anyway so do whatever you like because all life dies with no memory of suffering... Both are totally defeatist, life is a unique and interesting bloom of colour in the white noise of chaos, and suffering is equally as beautiful and interesting as any other state of life that has evolved, suffering has its place in the balance. As humans we have the ability to experience empathy and therein lies our responsibility (which matters to no one but ourselves) - to minimize unnecessary suffering, but certainly not to eliminate it in all forms as you propose, hence eliminating all life.
Humans lived for millions of years as part of the balance, capitalism is NOT "too close to human nature" or whatever you said to that effect and can be eliminated, as there is in fact No solid genetic human nature in regards to social or economic structuring, there is only human behavior - and that's always been changed throughout history and across cultures. The Capitalism free market cult itself is responsible for most of the animal suffering you have mentioned and can be replaced with superior modernized systems geared towards true sustainability (and with that comes the elimination of animal agriculture and a switch to global veganism). It is not unrealistic to think that it can and will be replaced. Technology is the way out of the twisted dependence on animal agriculture, along with the elimination of obsolete and deeply diseased social & economic systems, which will either be achieved naturally as humanity pushes its environment to the limits and is forced to redesign, or a gradual shift (less likely). So, things such as veganism and organic farming create precedent for future positive changes even if they are imperfect in the current forms, and while humans are 90% fucked in the head at this point in time, they are only products of their social environment and can be remoulded in any direction over time or through forced adaptation.
As for the idea that all other animals should also be killed because through natural exposure to life they experience suffering is fucked up logic, and relies on the (arguably speciesist human assumption) that pain and suffering in all forms is bad or evil - it would be more logical for you to kill yourself in order to avoid experiencing your pain of witnessing life. Destroying humanity, its consumemachines, its web of profit motivated torture is by all means an understandable desire, but to decide the fate of all life on this planet because you can't understand its balance, or because it is revolting to you personally is ridiculous. The praying mantis that is killed by its mate after fucking, is lucky to have experienced life at all - things die, animals hurt each other, kids are mean. Life is beautiful in all its painful glory, the problem lies in not that suffering exists, but that humans create it consciously and unnecessarily to such detestable extremes. Life systems exist without your approval or condemnation and being a human you only have cause to interfere with human issues, or ideally things which affect the continuation and balance of life systems on this earth...the social interactions of dolphins is none of your concern.
On one hand to whinge about the suffering caused by meat/dairy industry and not attempt to smash it down by force, while on the other hand encouraging the killing of all life on this planet is the logic of a sick mind overwhelmed with the hopelessness of it all.
Your website encourages apathy rather than inspiring budding WMD designers... It is also damaging to positive animal rights campaigns, and provides more excuses for governments to push bullshit mandatory internet censorship laws.
Humans lived for millions of years as part of the balance, capitalism is NOT "too close to human nature" or whatever you said to that effect and can be eliminated, as there is in fact No solid genetic human nature in regards to social or economic structuring, there is only human behavior - and that's always been changed throughout history and across cultures. The Capitalism free market cult itself is responsible for most of the animal suffering you have mentioned and can be replaced with superior modernized systems geared towards true sustainability (and with that comes the elimination of animal agriculture and a switch to global veganism). It is not unrealistic to think that it can and will be replaced. Technology is the way out of the twisted dependence on animal agriculture, along with the elimination of obsolete and deeply diseased social & economic systems, which will either be achieved naturally as humanity pushes its environment to the limits and is forced to redesign, or a gradual shift (less likely). So, things such as veganism and organic farming create precedent for future positive changes even if they are imperfect in the current forms, and while humans are 90% fucked in the head at this point in time, they are only products of their social environment and can be remoulded in any direction over time or through forced adaptation.
As for the idea that all other animals should also be killed because through natural exposure to life they experience suffering is fucked up logic, and relies on the (arguably speciesist human assumption) that pain and suffering in all forms is bad or evil - it would be more logical for you to kill yourself in order to avoid experiencing your pain of witnessing life. Destroying humanity, its consumemachines, its web of profit motivated torture is by all means an understandable desire, but to decide the fate of all life on this planet because you can't understand its balance, or because it is revolting to you personally is ridiculous. The praying mantis that is killed by its mate after fucking, is lucky to have experienced life at all - things die, animals hurt each other, kids are mean. Life is beautiful in all its painful glory, the problem lies in not that suffering exists, but that humans create it consciously and unnecessarily to such detestable extremes. Life systems exist without your approval or condemnation and being a human you only have cause to interfere with human issues, or ideally things which affect the continuation and balance of life systems on this earth...the social interactions of dolphins is none of your concern.
On one hand to whinge about the suffering caused by meat/dairy industry and not attempt to smash it down by force, while on the other hand encouraging the killing of all life on this planet is the logic of a sick mind overwhelmed with the hopelessness of it all.
Your website encourages apathy rather than inspiring budding WMD designers... It is also damaging to positive animal rights campaigns, and provides more excuses for governments to push bullshit mandatory internet censorship laws.