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Messages - Nvhemt

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General Discussion / Re: flexitarians
« on: October 17, 2011, 04:54:42 AM »
I unfortunately agree and want to add that for many even the theoretical option is sufficient to legitimatize the consumption of animal based products, people don’t have to actually consume products made of grass-fed, organic, free range, daily petted animals.
Although I agree with your point, I want to take a second and address an obvious issue that was somehow left out; regarding the true reality within the laureate Polyface. (for those of you who don’t know, Polyface is a private farm which was brought to the readers’ minds in the Omnivore’s Dilemma as a piece of heaven on earth). Let’s say Michael Pollan (the author of the book) described the place thoroughly but far from accurately, and was very selective about facts and figures.
It doesn’t take MD in psychology to realize Michael Pollan’s judgment is completely clouded by his, desperate seeking for excuses to eat meat, but the length he went to picture polyface as opposite to what it really is, is just astonishing.
Too bad that on his personal quest for conscience sedation he misled hundreds of thousand of readers- perhaps even some of the writers here.
I’m sure there are no Polyface farm or Pollan admirers in this forum but before this discussion becomes too theoretical, I want to prove that presenting this farm as an ideal symbiosis between humans and nonhumans is an outrage.
To avoid version dispute I supported my description with videos from youtube that you can all see or more accurately for you to show since I figure you don’t need the proof personally.

In the following videos you can see how the chicks live their first days in polyface:
"Polyface Farms-Swoope, VA (Baby chicks)"
"Newmans at Polyface Farm"
And the worst one is "Polyface_ Baby Chicks"

Joel Salatin, Polyface’s owner, said in the video “JoelSalatinUrbanFarmStore1” that he buys his chicks from a hatchery. His explanation why is…"We get them in batches of 3,000 to 4,000. I am not a believer of independence to the point of being so independent that you become inefficient."
Entirely self assured, without giving the slightest thought about the implication for the animals, Salatin reveals they’re all genetically distorted- condemned to pain and suffering from birth.
How can Salatin claims that he enables the real character of the animals to be expressed, when he raises ailing industrial breeds and not natural ones. Him and pollan are engaged in playing ethologists while completely disregarding that these are not natural breeds living natural lives.
The chickens in polyface live for 8 weeks. that’s 2 more than in the average industrial broiler farm. Not much time for letting the chickens express their "chickenes".

The video "keeping food local at polyface farm" shows how the chickens are handled, grabbed upside down from the legs and thrown into the plastic crates onto the truck to be slaughtered.

In the video "chicken processing tutorial" chicken slaughter is shown at about minute two.

Another chicken slaughter video is called "polyface poultry kill cones w_ grady".

In "Featherman tutorial – bleeding out a chicken" no matter what the narrator of the video says, the slaughter looks awful and violent as ever. Obviously.

The video "Polyface Processing Overview" demonstrates chickens taken from the crates and aggressively shoved into slaughter cones and then slaughtered. Just as in the conventional industrial production lines, the chickens still flipper after their throat is sliced until they are thrown into the boiled water tank to loosen their feathers before their removal. It’s proudly announced in this video that they are "processing” 470 chickens per 2 hours. That’s 4 a minute or 25 seconds per chicken. Time is money in Polyface just as much.

A repeated saying in the videos states that "this is the most humane killing there is…".
The question why settle for the most human killing while it can so easily be avoided never crosses their minds. Absorbed so well within their own persuasion role, they’re even able to praise a slaughter as it occurs right in front of them.

The cows in pollyface are ear tagged as can be seen in the unintentionally ironically titled "what happens when you are surrounded by over 400 happy polyface".

Obligated by restrictions of US law, Salatin sends the cows to slaughter as they reach 30 months old. From then on it’s the same nightmarish conveyor belt mass production; the Poliface cows are loaded onto trucks and transported to an industrial slaughterhouse. By allowing this, Salatin also breaks his own principle of locality, the one he so often boasts about.

"polyface_piggies" shows pigs held in a pen. It’s noticeably better than any industrial pen I’ve encountered- but is still a pen. The book, as far as I recall gives off an impression of pen free raising.

Another video presenting pigs in pens is "Polyface Farms-Swoope, VA (Cute pig)"

In one of Joel Salatin’s lectures, he explained the pigs live for about 8 months after grown for 2 months at another farm. Conditions in the farm they were born were left unmentioned by him or by Pollan in the book.

In the video "class tour of polyface farm – apart 1 – chicken coop" pigs are seen enclosed in a small fenced area, expressing their "pigness".
4 minutes afterwards views rabbits breeding in Polyface. Never a picture more far away from the pastured ideal Salatin has drawn. They are all held locked, many isolated in a small cage. They live above ground and chickens are on the ground below making plenty of noise which I‘m sure is very stressful for the rabbits. I read the book a few years ago and I don’t recall Pollan mentioning caged rabbits who live much like in the industrial rabbit meat.

The video "polyface farm part 2" shows rabbits who live in a different cage, a wooden frame with metal filament fence that enables them a view of the outside, some sun, fresh air and to eat grass. Still a cage though. Also, they seem to be distressed by the movement of their mobile cage (like the chickens they are moved to a new piece of grass every day).

In the video “Polyface_ Rabbits” there are rabbits in battery cages. They’re bigger than industrial battery cages but still tiny and made of wire mesh. Again, many are isolated and all are suffering from a lot of noise from the farm and the chickens as this video conveys.

"Everything Moves at Polyface Farms" is another video that exhibits rabbits not in battery cages but in similar cages of the ones that the chickens are imprisoned in.

"polyface farm – pastured poultry – part 3" shows Salatin demonstrates how to move the chickens from one pasture place to another (shoving a dolly under their cage and carry it entirely from place to place), it’s impossible to miss the fear the chickens experience each time a human comes near their cage (unless the one who’s looking prefers not to notice, and has also convinced himself he observes natural chicken surrounding).

Joel also explains in this video that in Polyface they also grow chickens for people who order a few dozens to grow in their small farm. They sell more than a thousand chickens a year for those small farms that don’t necessarily raise them on an eggmobile (put eggmobile in youtube to see what it means). Joel doesn’t check how the chickens he grow and sell to others live. It is a nice profit so he doesn’t’ ask questions or bind his customers to a certain growing rules.

But the most important thing to learn from this video is that again, as opposed to the picture the typical reader might get while reading the omnivore’s dilemma, the chickens in polyface are caged chickens.
Someone who never visited the farm or watched the videos and relays solely on the book is likely to be convinced that Polyface in fact provides a good life for animals. Even cynical and skeptical as I am- I was sure they are free to roam the field. Polyface was regarded in the book as animals’ heaven, with much emphasis on providing the animals with respectful lives.
I personally believe Joel that he cares about the environment, but he does so from his own very egocentric angle; as he describes himself, a christian, libertarian, capitalist, environmentalist farmer. He declares in that video that he is not ashamed of being capitalist, stating that the farm should be first of all profitable. He also states that he has no problem killing animals as he believes they don’t have a soul (maybe this statement was made in a different video). I think these two features give away the true nature of his farm which is eventually all about producing a good product, that is, quality corpses.

Just think considering that’s how he twisted the reality that was revealed right before his own eyes how loudly it speaks about the rest of his writings.    
People must be sobered from the illusion of cruelty free animal based diet.

Discussions about specific materials / All babies
« on: January 09, 2010, 12:35:25 PM »
I still don’t know how to take you but after watching “All Babies” which caught my eye because I figured it’s got something with the song, I understand that human haters you are definitely not.

You wrote somewhere in you’re FAQ that you have 7 articles regarding human issues as victims can you direct me to them because your hinted names don’t reveal the article’s topic.
Anyway the ‘All babies” slideshow is a great answer to anyone who blames you for human hating.

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